tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post1520940090245098682..comments2024-01-16T05:48:33.523-05:00Comments on Errata Security: Learn to read Wikipedia!David Maynorhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09921229607193067441noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-35786749875873787782012-08-09T17:05:59.812-04:002012-08-09T17:05:59.812-04:00And with that, you have another interested reader....And with that, you have another interested reader... Cheers.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05568413679911854575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-59697622781364991922012-08-06T03:12:01.054-04:002012-08-06T03:12:01.054-04:00Dan, you are probably right.
I was really intendi...Dan, you are probably right.<br /><br />I was really intending to criticize the original article on Slate, which was horrible. I can understand why Schneier would trust that a "well respected" journalist would probably do his job. But that journalist didn't, and in my opinion, deserves strong language to describe his failure.<br /><br />At least Schneier updated his post, but William Saleton hasn't updated the original article.Robert Grahamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09879238874208877740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-90893782607755628162012-08-05T08:31:20.141-04:002012-08-05T08:31:20.141-04:00I think you have a style problem that presents its...I think you have a style problem that presents itself in this blog post. Your level of emotion and use of stronger words either shows you to be a bit of a muckraker or worse... that you are one of your own accused.<br /><br />Making references to "bringing out the stupid in people" and "sounding like an idiot" for not simply checking Wikipedia is, to me, farcical when you consider that you are talking about the opinion of a cryptographic expert. The man is clearly not stupid.<br /><br />He may be wrong, he may have gotten the wrong impression, but calling him "stupid" or an "idiot" (in any form) does your point no justice at all, and makes you sound merely reactionary. The result of this is that some of your readers will conclude that you are on one particular side of the issue (and they have commented thusly). If you are, that's fine, but you could still drop the name-calling and still be able to make a point.<br /><br />I don't comment on this to shame you, but merely because without all the hoopla, you do make a good point. Don't let good points get lost with too much "color" in them.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05568413679911854575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-42101055390256923892012-08-04T23:57:42.415-04:002012-08-04T23:57:42.415-04:00Two are well trained, and would've calmly take...<i>Two are well trained, and would've calmly taken aim and shot the shooter.</i><br /><br />Well, this is easy to say in hindsight, when you know the facts. But, when you're attending a big budget action movie premiere, you might well see some sort of promotional play acting going on. Calmly shoot one of the actors and you are well in the poo. <br /><br />Shoot outs for entertainment are not that rare. I've seen one at the Fort Worth Stockyards, for example, and while it's pretty corney, it is a simulated gun battle in a public place. <br /><br />Mistakes and misjudgements happen every day with guns in public. Just ask any ER surgeon. <br /><br />As for Wikipedia being a fair dinkum authority, I'm a Wikipedia editor of many years standing, and I take everything I read there with a grain of salt. Vast slabs of the thing remain unsourced, and there are always people who like to slant their opinions into the text. Still, we usually get a good handle on breaking events simply because we have a lot of eyes on the article at the same time.Skyringhttp://skyring.com.aunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-363589574571574952012-08-03T15:28:29.039-04:002012-08-03T15:28:29.039-04:00Daniel,
Thanks for input. Maybe I'm deluding ...Daniel,<br /><br />Thanks for input. Maybe I'm deluding myself about trying to see both sides.<br /><br />But I feel that if you want to argue "gun control", then you should point out the 100 people/day that die to gun violence across the country that's unusually high compared to other developed nations, not the 12 people that died in once incident. Crazies going on shooting sprees is actually not statistically more likely in America -- but day to day gun violence is.<br /><br />I'm not trying to argue gun control, I'm just trying to argue that "anecdotes" are are for stupid people, statistics and citing references are for smart people.<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence<br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rampage_killersRobert Grahamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09879238874208877740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-62962565045071435552012-08-03T00:17:51.259-04:002012-08-03T00:17:51.259-04:00"I'm not trying to argue gun control in t..."I'm not trying to argue gun control in this post,..."<br /><br />"I'm not trying to argue one side of this political debate..."<br /><br />This "I am not arguing X" while you are in fact arguing X is getting old fast.<br /><br />Your final para makes your position clear. You are for people going armed to theaters under the theory that trained shooters would calmly shoot the shooter while 500 people in panic are running to the exits in the dark.<br /><br />It's a bad theory, but what really grates are the faux "I am not arguing" pleas of innocence.Danielnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-51014827816791229472012-08-02T13:27:40.601-04:002012-08-02T13:27:40.601-04:00Regarding the North Hollywood shootout, those guys...Regarding the North Hollywood shootout, those guys were taking body armor to a silly level. They were intending suicide-by-cop, and wanted to make it difficult for the cops. (A profoundly rude way to go, and thankfully it's almost exclusively the domain of the less-competent. These guys were very much the exception in that regard.)<br /><br />A head shot was difficult for those cops because they (quite sensibly) couldn't close to handgun-headshot distance, and most cops aren't especially good shooters anyway (and shouldn't be expected to be, that's not their job).<br /><br />In a crowded movie theater in full hair-on-fire panic mode, getting a clear shot is somewhere between hard and utterly impossible. But at least the distance involved is pretty short, making a head shot entirely viable for anyone who actually trains.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-62504755294891741432012-08-02T11:21:50.663-04:002012-08-02T11:21:50.663-04:00Well, I what Wikipedia should teach anyone is that...Well, I what Wikipedia should teach anyone is that it is never black or white.<br /><br />For example, we can quote <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout</a>, which clearly states that the shooters took multiple direct body hits and simply continued, thanks to body armor. Of course, that lead to the use of more powerful calibers among police forces, but it clearly points to the advantage of body armor if you want to cause havoc.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-89575247119546600432012-08-01T22:57:05.317-04:002012-08-01T22:57:05.317-04:00To Williams Richards:
You prove my point. There i...To Williams Richards:<br /><br />You prove my point. There is no confirmation he wore any sort of protective vest. And yes, following Wikipedia links to the source they site is part of the "checking". You followed the source, and found no evidence.<br /><br />Yes, you found something confusing. It's plausible that it might be body armor, but that's not evidence. Whether you use it as evidence (like William Saletan) depends upon your ethics.Robert Grahamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09879238874208877740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-75109065463464227732012-08-01T20:12:15.244-04:002012-08-01T20:12:15.244-04:00Here's the vest he was wearing. It's a lo...Here's the vest he was wearing. It's a load-bearing vest and not a ballistic vest.<br />http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2012/07/james_holes_tactical_gear_assault_vest_threats.phpGeorgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10128704008699660671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-6599175646678030412012-08-01T19:57:22.464-04:002012-08-01T19:57:22.464-04:00They aren't metal plates either. They are spec...They aren't metal plates either. They are specially designed ceramics.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-45087574504156567962012-08-01T19:35:08.460-04:002012-08-01T19:35:08.460-04:00First, I find your assertion "learn to read W...First, I find your assertion "learn to read Wikipedia" sort of absurd in the first place. It implies a level of authority that I don't think exists with Wikipedia.<br /><br />Wikipedia is incredibly useful, don't get me wrong. I use it daily. But it's anything but authoritative.<br /><br />But to play your game, I clicked the link to the Wiki article that you linked to.<br /><br />Indeed, the Wiki article says "He was dressed in black and wore a gas mask, a load-bearing vest, a ballistic helmet, bullet-resistant leggings, a throat protector, a groin protector and tactical gloves." You are correct. This implies that it wasn't a Kevlar vest or other bullet resistant design.<br /><br />So I click on the citation for that very passage, which goes to:<br /><br />http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_21118947<br /><br />There it says "Oates said he was dressed in black and wearing a ballistic helmet and vest, ballistic leggings, throat and groin protector and gas mask and black tactical gloves. He was armed with three weapons."<br /><br />Maybe it was a Kevlar vest. Maybe it wasn't. But the Wikipedia article that implies it wasn't cites a Denver Post article that is phrased in a way that seems to imply it was.<br /><br />Learn to read Wikipedia, indeed.William Richardshttp://pyromosh.org/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37798047.post-89954688039473384102012-08-01T19:33:37.415-04:002012-08-01T19:33:37.415-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.dildoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08644806947448350122noreply@blogger.com